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JFK Dealey Plaza Witnesses: John McAdams Strange List

JFK Dealey Plaza Witnesses: John McAdams Strange List

Richard Charnin
Feb.26, 2014
Updated: May 10, 2014

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The JFK Calc spreadsheet was originally created to analyze unnatural material witness death probabilities. The spreadsheet has been enhanced to include Dealey Plaza witness observations of the origin of the shots, the Limo stop and the “Double Bang” (two near simultaneous shots). The statistical analysis proves there were at least two shooters. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjAk1JUWDMyRdDFSU3NVd29xWWNyekd2X1ZJYllKTnc#gid=65

In the four surveys of Dealey Plaza witness observations on the source of shots, only John McAdams indicates that the majority came from the Texas School Book Depository. His survey is the only one quoted in Wikipedia.

This post analyzes the discrepancies in witness observations between McAdams (37 Knoll) and the “Adjusted” (93 Knoll) survey. The data is based on Warren Commission testimony and witnesses who were not called to testify.

In McAdams’ survey 21 had no opinion, 14 were not asked, 14 said the shots came from the TSBD. These were classified as Grassy Knoll witnesses in the “Adjusted” survey.

In JFK Calc, the data can be sorted by witness name, observation and group. Code “1” in column B denotes a difference between Feldman, McAdams, Galanor and the Adjusted Charnin list.

Dallas Deputy Sheriffs (19)
Fifteen (15) said shots were from the Grassy Knoll and 4 were not asked.
But according to McAdams, 5 had no opinion and 12 were not asked.

Dallas Police (14)
The adjusted list has 4 TSBD, 6 Grassy Knoll, 1 both. 2 no opinion, 1 not asked.
McAdams list has 6 TSBD and 2 Grassy Knoll witnesses.

Secret Service (17)
The adjusted list has 6 TSBD, 4 GK, 1 TSBD and GK, 5 no opinion, 1 not asked.
McAdams has 10 TSBD, 1 GK, 1 both, 2 no opinion, 3 not asked.
SS agent Roy Kellerman implied that there was at least one Grassy Knoll shooter. He said “President Kennedy had four wounds, two in the head and shoulder and the neck. Governor Connally, from our reports, had three. There have got to be more than three shots”. This is amazing testimony that no one talks about. McAdams claims Kellerman said the shots were fired from the TSBD – a clear contradiction of his WC testimony.

SS agent Clint Hill has maintained for 50 years that he saw a massive gaping wound at the right rear of JFK’s head. This implies a shot from the front, contradicting the autopsy photos. McAdams claims Hill said shots were fired from the TSBD – a contradiction of his testimony.

TSBD Employees (22)
The adjusted group has 11 GK, 6 TSBD, 1 elsewhere, 2 no opinion, 2 not asked.
McAdams had 8 Grassy Knoll, 7 TSBD, 1 no opinion, 2 not asked.

Reporters (5)
Mary Woodward is a McAdams Grassy Knoll witness. But McAdams does not include three reporters standing with Woodward: Alonzo, Brown and Donaldson or Mike Brownlow, another reporter.

Other witnesses
Charles Brehm was initially quoted in the Dallas Times: “The shots came from in front of or beside the President.” McAdams claims that Brehm said they came from the TSBD.
Abraham Zapruder testified: “Shots came from in back of me”. McAdams said Zapruder had no opinion and only “inferred” that the shots came from the knoll because the right side of Kennedy’s head exploded, and he saw people were running up the knoll.
J.C. Price said “shots were from behind the wooden fence at the triple overpass” and was not called by the Warren Commission. McAdams said that Price did not give an opinion.

These witnesses were not mentioned by McAdams or called by the Warren Commission:
Beverly Oliver Massagee, the “Babushka Lady”, testified at ARRB.
Julia Ann Mercer saw a man carrying a rifle up the knoll.
Ed Hoffman saw two men at the fence, smoke and a rifle.

In John McAdams Dealey Plaza witness survey, he writes: “Over the years, several students of the assassination have tabulated testimony of witnesses who heard the shots in Dealey Plaza. This sounds like a precise and scientific way of going about analyzing evidence, but in reality the tabulations have differed radically in the results they have produced. Not surprisingly, students who believe there were multiple shooters have found more witnesses who heard shots from the Knoll, and fewer who heard shots from the Depository. People who believe that Oswald was the only shooter have consistently found more witnesses who heard shots from the Depository than from the Grassy Knoll.

The table below shows the assessments of four different scholars who have tabulated earwitness testimony. In addition, I have included my own assessment — based on a thorough canvass of testimony by my students — in the next-to-last column. In making any tabulation, a scholar must face a variety of problems and challenges. In producing my own assessment, I have used the following rules.”

Although McAdams’ students did the survey, he had the final word on interpreting the results. Not surprisingly, the majority of witnesses in his survey claimed they heard shots from the Texas Book Depository.

Links to Surveys and WC testimony
Warren Commission: http://jfkassassination.net/russ/wit.htm
Feldman http://spot.acorn.net/jfkplace/09/fp.back_issues/12th_Issue/51_wits.html
Galanor http://www.history-matters.com/analysis/witness/Index.htm .

In this article, Galanor discusses the McAdams and HSCA surveys: In 1977, the HSCA interviewed 178 witnesses based on FBI reports and the Warren Commission. Of the 178, 49 said shots were from the TSBD and only 21 from the Knoll. The HSCA failed to reveal who the witnesses were! http://jfklancer.com/pdf/galanor.pdf

McAdams http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/earwitnesses.htm

Charnin (adjusted): https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjAk1JUWDMyRdDFSU3NVd29xWWNyekd2X1ZJYllKTnc#gid=65

………………………………………………..
Stewart Galanor on the Warren Commission and HSCA
The Art and Science of Misrepresenting Evidence
How the Warren Commission and the House Select Committee on Assassinations manipulated evidence to dismiss witness accounts of the assassination. http://www.history-matters.com/analysis/witness/artScience.htm

Over six hundred people witnessed the assassination of President Kennedy. The FBI acting on behalf of the Warren Commission interviewed at least two hundred of them.
Regrettably, the Commission seemed unconcerned that the FBI reports on seventy of these interviews did not reveal if the witness had an opinion on the source of the shots. Nor did the Commission conduct an analysis of witness accounts or give any credence to those accounts of witnesses who thought the shots came from the grassy knoll.

Analysis of 178 Witnesses
In 1978 the House Select Committee on Assassinations analyzed the accounts of the witnesses taken by the Warren Commission and from FBI reports published in the 26 Volumes of Hearings and Exhibits that accompanied the Warren Report. In analyzing witness accounts, a diligent investigator would consider various issues that the House Committee failed to address.

Witnesses Not Called
According to the HSCA, 692 witnesses “were present in the Plaza during the assassination.” Most of them were never called to testify by either the Warren Commission or the HSCA. (8HSCA139)

Ed Johnson, a reporter for the Fort Worth Star-Telegram who was riding in the motorcade, wrote for his paper the next day, “Some of us saw little puffs of white smoke that seemed to hit the grassy area in the esplanade that divides Dallas’ main downtown streets.” He was never interviewed by any government agency.

Overzealous Analysis
Any analysis of the 216 witnesses is inherently biased towards producing an unrealistically high percentage of Depository witnesses. Of the 216 witnesses who were interviewed by the FBI or the Warren Commission, 73 of them were Dallas Police Officers, Dallas Deputy Sheriffs, Secret Service Agents and other government employees who traditionally tend to identify with the government’s case. Thus, the tabulation of 216 witnesses (culled from the Warren Commission’s 26 Volumes and from Commission Documents stored in the National Archives) does not constitute a random sample of the witnesses to the assassination. Hence, it cannot be the basis for an accurate statistical analysis of witness accounts. What happens if we separate out the 73 government employees from the 143 nongovernment employees?

143 Non-government Employees
Depository 22; Knoll 44

73 Government Employees
Depository 26; Knoll 8

In the nongovernment group, the number of Knoll witnesses is two times larger than the Depository witnesses, while in the government group, the number of Depository witnesses is three times larger than the number of Knoll witnesses.

The House Committee’s analysis of witness accounts is a disingenuous attempt to dismiss and discredit evidence that the shots were fired from at least two locations. The evidence of a shooter firing from behind the fence is staggering, not least of which is the testimony of witnesses who heard shots or saw smoke on the grassy knoll.

What does it all mean? The testimony of Dealey Plaza eyewitnesses is, by itself, overwhelming evidence that Lee Harvey Oswald was just a patsy. Along with the astronomical odds against 100 unnatural material witness deaths, we have proven two conspiracies: the planning of the assassination and the cover-up. If Lee Harvey Oswald was a Lone-nut assassin as John McAdams and Warren Commission apologists claim, there would not be anything to “clean-up”, would there?

This 1964 article by Vincent Salandria, one of the original assassination researchers, is an excellent summary of the evidence. http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/HWNAU/VJS110264.html
………………………………………………..
Data Summary

Survey... Feldman McAdams Galanor Adjusted
Total Witnesses 121 241 216 224
Opinion..........83 100 109 133
Source of Shots:
Grassy Knoll.....51 35 52 84
Book Depository..32 61 48 36
Both TB and GK....0 2 5 9
Other locations...0 2 4 4
No Opinion.......38 69 37 36
Not asked.........0 72 70 54
Percentages:
Grassy Knoll....61% 35% 48% 63%
Book Depository.39% 61% 44% 27%
GK / (GK+TB)....61% 36% 52% 70%

GALINOR SURVEY ANALYSIS

100 of 273 witnesses gave an opinion (52 GK, 48 TSBD)
66 NON GOVT:
44 GK (84.6% of 52 GK total witnesses)
22 TSBD (45.8% of 48 TSBD total witnesses)
34 GOVT:
8 GK (15.4% of 52 total GK witnesses; 17.7 (52%) expected)
26 TSBD (54.2% of 48 total TSBD witnesses; 16.3 (48%) expected)

PROBABILITY OF NON-GOVT vs. GOVT WITNESS DISCREPANCY
Z-Score =4.43
P= 1 – NORMSDIST(Z-SCORE)
P= 0.000004779 or 1 in 209,250

SENSITIVITY ANALYSIS
66 Non-government witnesses
TSBD GK 1 in
22 44 209,250 (actual)
26 40 142
30 36 4
32 34 2
………………………………………………..

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Posted by on February 26, 2014 in JFK

 

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JFK Dealey Plaza Witnesses: A Survey Comparison

JFK Dealey Plaza Witnesses: A Survey Comparison

Richard Charnin
Feb. 26, 2014
Updated: Feb. 28, 2014

Click Reclaiming Science:The JFK Conspiracy to look inside the book.

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An analysis of four surveys of witnesses at Dealey Plaza yielded surprising results. Of witnesses who said shots were fired from either the Grassy Knoll (GK) or the Texas School Book Depository (TSBD), three surveys (Feldman, Galanor, Adjusted) indicated that 61%, 52% and 67% said shots came from the GK. But Warren Commission apologist John McAdams’ indicated just 35%.

This is an analysis of John McAdams Strange List: https://richardcharnin.wordpress.com/2014/02/26/jfk-dealey-plaza-witnesses-john-mcadams-strange-list/

The following witness data has been added to the JFKCalc spreadsheet:

Dealy Plaza witnesses: Surveys of Source of Shots: Misinformation from the HSCA and John McAdams. In this article, Galanor discusses the McAdams and HSCA surveys: http://jfklancer.com/pdf/galanor.pdf

Harold Feldman (1965): 121 eyewitnesses: 51 said Grassy Knoll, 32 TSBD, 38 had no opinion. http://spot.acorn.net/jfkplace/09/fp.back_issues/12th_Issue/51_wits.html

Stewart Galanor (1988) 216 eyewitnesses: 52 GK, 48 TB, 5 GK and TB;TB, 4 elsewhere, 37 no opinion. http://www.history-matters.com/analysis/witness/Index.htm

John McAdams: 241 eyewitnesses: 61 TSBD, 35 GK, 2 GK and TB, 2 elsewhere, 69 no opinion.  http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/earwitnesses.htm

Charnin (adjusted): 223 eyewitnesses: 84 GK, 39 TSBD; 6 GK and TB; 4 elsewhere, 38 no opinion. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjAk1JUWDMyRdDFSU3NVd29xWWNyekd2X1ZJYllKTnc#gid=65

HSCA (1977): 178 witnesses based on FBI reports and the Warren Commission: 49 said shots were from the TSBD and only 21 from the Knoll. The HSCA failed to reveal who the witnesses were!

Stewart Galanor wrote: How the Warren Commission and the House Select Committee on Assassinations manipulated evidence to dismiss witness accounts of the assassination. http://www.history-matters.com/analysis/witness/artScience.htm

“Over six hundred people witnessed the assassination of President Kennedy. The FBI acting on behalf of the Warren Commission interviewed at least two hundred of them. Regrettably, the Commission seemed unconcerned that the FBI reports on seventy of these interviews did not reveal if the witness had an opinion on the source of the shots. Nor did the Commission conduct an analysis of witness accounts or give any credence to those accounts of witnesses who thought the shots came from the grassy knoll.

In 1978 the House Select Committee on Assassinations analyzed the accounts of the witnesses taken by the Warren Commission and from FBI reports published in the 26 Volumes of Hearings and Exhibits that accompanied the Warren Report. In analyzing witness accounts, a diligent investigator would consider various issues that the House Committee failed to address. According to the HSCA, 692 witnesses “were present in the Plaza during the assassination.” Most of them were never called to testify by either the Warren Commission or the HSCA. (8HSCA139)

 
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Posted by on February 24, 2014 in JFK

 

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JFK Assassination: Was Lee Harvey Oswald standing in front of the Texas Book Depository at 12:30?

JFK Assassination: Was Oswald standing in front of the Texas Book Depository at 12:30?

Richard Charnin
Feb. 13, 2014
Updated: Dec.29, 2014

Click Reclaiming Science:The JFK Conspiracy to look inside the book.

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From the JFK Lancer site: Previously it had been told there were no notes taken from the Oswald interrogations the weekend of President Kennedy’s assassination, but first FBI Agent Hosty found his notes (included in his book) and now the Fritz notes are found. Released by the ARRB 11-20-97. According to Dallas Captain Will Fritz’s notes, Oswald said he was “out with Bill Shelley in front”. http://www.jfklancer.com/Fritzdocs.html

Latest update: Judyth Baker, author of “Me and Lee”, has done a pixel analysis of Oswald’s shirt vs. Lovelady’s which proves Oswald is Doorman. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1X2eD2Wl3xSmRHTuE02ntfYkb3ES2Kuo8wl3HHzzAlD8/pub

Smoking Gun?
In Altgens 6, Lovelady appears to be standing on the steps in front. His face was cut out – except for the top right corner. Oswald was standing on the TOP level (1st floor) by the doorway.

David Von Pein writes:
There were TWO arrows placed on the photo at the Warren Commission. The first arrow was placed by Buell Frazier pointing to Doorman standing at the extreme left. Frazier claimed it was Billy Lovelady.
http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=20007 http://oi50.tinypic.com/2lxgvi9.jpg

CE369 was first marked with an arrow by Buell Wesley Frazier on March 11, 1964, at 2 H 242: http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh2/html/WC_Vol2_0125b.htm

And that same exhibit was then marked with another arrow by Billy Lovelady himself on April 7, 1964 (at 6 H 338): http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh6/html/WC_Vol6_0174b.htm

Now, from the testimony, it’s a bit unclear as to which witness (Frazier or Lovelady) drew in the dark arrow that is easily visible in CE369. But that visible arrow might very well have been drawn by Frazier and not Lovelady. But I’m not entirely sure of that.

But Joseph Ball’s instructions to Lovelady might give a clue. Ball told Lovelady:
“Take a pen or pencil and mark an arrow where you are. …. Draw an arrow down to that; do it in the dark. You got an arrow in the dark and one in the white pointing toward you.”

So, via the above testimony, it’s possible that Lovelady’s arrow is “in the dark” and cannot be easily seen.

I suppose this confusion about who drew the dark arrow pointing to Doorway Man in CE369 will spark some additional controversy concerning the true identity of the man in the TSBD doorway, with some conspiracy theorists possibly wanting to now claim that Billy Lovelady didn’t really mark CE369 at all with an arrow in 1964.

But it’s quite clear to me from the Warren Commission records that BOTH Wesley Frazier AND Billy Lovelady drew separate arrows pointing to the SAME PERSON (Doorway Man) in Commission Exhibit No. 369.

And, of course, as I’ve pointed out in previous posts, there’s also Wes Frazier’s testimony at the 1986 mock trial in London, where Frazier identified Doorway Man as Lovelady.”
… End of Von Pein’s post….

David Von Pein is wrong. Frazier did not identify Lovelady as Doorman. Frazier testified that Lovelady was standing three or four steps BELOW him. Doorman was standing on the TOP level (the first floor), where Frazier was standing. And it is clear that Frazier contradicted himself when he placed the arrow in the white area pointing to Lovelady as Doorman. But he testified FIVE times that Lovelady was standing on the steps in FRONT of him.

Let’s look at Lovelady’s Warren Commission testimony. He clearly states that he was in front, standing on the steps. http://jfkassassination.net/russ/testimony/lovelady.htm

Mr. LOVELADY – That’s on the second floor; so, I started going to the domino room where I generally went in to set down and eat and nobody was there and I happened to look on the outside and Mr. Shelley was standing outside with Miss Sarah Stanton, I believe her name is, and I said, “Well, I’ll go out there and talk with them, sit down and eat my lunch out there, set on the steps,” so I went out there.
Mr. BALL – You ate your lunch on the steps?
Mr. LOVELADY – Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL – Who was with you?
Mr. LOVELADY – Bill Shelley and Sarah Stanton, and right behind me….
Mr. BALL – What was that last name?
Mr. LOVELADY – Stanton.
Mr. BALL – What is the first name?
Mr. LOVELADY – Bill Shelley.
Mr. BALL – And Stanton’s first name?
Mr. LOVELADY – Miss Sarah Stanton.
Mr. BALL – Did you stay on the steps
Mr. LOVELADY – Yes.
Mr. BALL – Were you there when the President’s motorcade went by
Mr. LOVELADY – Right.


Wesley Frazier confirmed Lovelady was on the steps in 5 interviews from 1963-86. If Lovelady was in front on the steps, he could not be Doorman standing on the top level. Frazier indirectly proved that Oswald was Doorman.
11/22/63 to the DPD
3/1/64 at the WC
2/13/69 at the Garrison/Shaw trial
1978 at HSCA
1986 at the Oswald Mock trial

11/22 Dallas PD (handwritten statement and affidavit)
Standing on the front steps.

3/1/64 Warren Commission
Frazier testified that Lovelady was standing two or three steps below him. http://jfkassassination.net/russ/testimony/frazierb1.htm

Mr. BALL – We have got a picture taken the day of the parade and it shows the President’s car going by.
Now, take a look at that picture. Can you see your picture any place there?
Mr. FRAZIER – No, sir; I don’t, because I was back up in this more or less black area here.
Mr. BALL – I see.

Mr. FRAZIER – Because Billy, like I say, is two or three steps down in front of me.

Mr. BALL – Do you recognize this fellow?
Mr. FRAZIER – That is Billy, that is Billy Lovelady.
Mr. BALL – Billy?
Mr. FRAZIER – Right
Mr. BALL – Let’s take a marker and make an arrow down that way. That mark is Billy Lovelady?
Mr. FRAZIER – Right.
Mr. BALL – That is where you told us you were standing a moment ago.
Mr. FRAZIER – Right.
Mr. BALL – In front of you to the right over to the wall?
Mr. FRAZIER – Yes.
Mr. BALL – Is this a Commission exhibit?
We will make this a Commission Exhibit No. 369.
(The document referred to was marked Commission Exhibit No. 369 for identification.)

2/13/69 Clay Shaw/Garrison trial http://www.jfk-online.com/fraziershaw.html

MR. ALCOCK:
Q: Can you see the spot where you were situated when the presidential motorcade came by?
A:Yes,sir,I can.
Q: Will you take this symbol and place it at that location where you were standing?
Q: Mr.Frazier, do you recall who you were with during the presidential motorcade?
A: Yes, sir, I can. When I was standing there at the top of the stairs, I was standing there by a heavyset lady who worked up in our office, her name is Sara, I forget her last name, but she was standing right there beside me when we watched the motorcade.
Q: Do you recall anyone else who may have been with you?
A: Right down in front of me at the bottom of the steps my foreman Bill Shelley and Billy Lovelady were standing there.

1978 HSCA interview by Moriarity and Day
Standing right on the steps

1986 Oswald Mock trial
Gerry Spence: “You recall that 23 years later that BNL was standing in front of you. About 4 steps in front of you. Is that correct?”
Frazier: Yes it is.

Billy Lovelady died in Jan. 1979 at the age of 41 by complications from a heart attack. The House Select Committee (HSCA) was in session. Billy did not testify.
The probability of a 41 year old white male dying from a heart attack in 1979 was 1 in 10,000.

Did Officer Baker and Roy Truly encounter Oswald on the 2nd floor? Not according to their initial testimony. http://jfkthelonegunmanmyth.blogspot.com/2013/01/the-lunchroom-encounter-that-never-was.html

http://theamericanchronicle.blogspot.com/2013/09/where-was-oswald-at-1230-pm-on-november.html

 
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Posted by on February 12, 2014 in JFK

 

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JFK: “Double Bang” Witness Testimony

JFK Witness Testimony on Hearing a Double Bang: A Math Analysis

Richard Charnin
Feb. 8, 2014
Updated: May 21, 2014

Click Reclaiming Science:The JFK Conspiracy to look inside the book.

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In the article The Guns of Dealey Plaza by John S. Craig, the author lists 22 individuals who testified they heard a “double bang”: the final two of three shots occurred nearly simultaneously.

If Oswald was the only shooter there would have been at least 2.3 seconds between shots, assuming he used the telescopic sight found on the Mannlicher Carcano.

If we assume a 0.50 probability that a given witness was correct in hearing two shots fired nearly simultaneously, then the probability of the witness being mistaken is also 0.50. The probability that ALL 22 witnesses listed below were mistaken is
P= 0.5^22 = 0.000000238 or 1 in 4 million.That is also the probability that Oswald fired the shots, since the Carcano was a bolt-action rifle and incapable of being fired at “double-bang” speed.

Andrew Mason determined that at least 44 witnesses heard a double bang. The probability all 44 would be mistaken is P=.5^44 = 5.7E-14 (1 in 17 trillion). http://www.dufourlaw.com/JFK/shot_pattern_excerpt.PDF

Let N = the number of witnesses who claimed shots came from the grassy knoll.
N Probability
22 2.4E-07
33 1.2E-10
44 5.7E-14

The Double Bang
http://spot.acorn.net/jfkplace/09/fp.back_issues/11th_Issue/guns_dp.html.
John Craig wrote:
The Warren Commission’s official conclusion concerning the “Number of Shots” states that all the shots were fired from the sixth-floor window at the southeast corner of the Texas School Book Depository Building. [58] The Commission stated that a consensus among witnesses at the scene was that three shots were fired, though some heard two shots and others heard four and perhaps as many as five or six shots. [59]

Numerous descriptions of the last two shots by so many witnesses leaves doubt as to whether Oswald was physically capable of firing both of the shots that so many characterized as being shot almost simultaneously, if not “automatically.”

It was the Commission’s belief that (a) one shot passed through the President’s neck and caused all of Governor Connally’s wounds, (b) a subsequent shot hit the President’s head, (c) no other shot struck any part of the automobile, and (d) three shots were fired with one missing, though which one missed is unknown. [60] “Two bullets probably caused all the wounds suffered by President Kennedy and Governor Connally. Since the preponderance of the evidence indicated that three shots were fired, the Commission concluded that one shot probably missed the Presidential limousine and its occupants, and that the three shots were fired in a time period ranging from approximately 4.8 to in excess of seven seconds.” [61]

FBI tests for the Warren Commission found that a 6.5 Mannlicher Carcano, bolt-action rifle, Model 91/38 required a minimum of 2.3 seconds to fire two shots. [62] The HSCA made tests in which the telescopic sight was removed to see how fast the rifle could be fired without aiming. Its tests resulted in firings of 1.65, 1.75, and just over two seconds. [63] The only way that the rifle could be fired this quickly was to simply maneuver the bolt action as fast as possible and shoot. The tests were not done with Oswald’s Mannlicher Carcano. Whether Oswald’s rifle was in a condition where it could be tested is questionable since “the pressure to open the bolt was so great that we tended to move the rifle off the target,” according to one of the Warren Commission testers. [64]

If Oswald were the only shooter there would have to be at least 2.3 seconds between shots, assuming he used the telescopic sight found on the Mannlicher Carcano. The three shots that the Warren Commission claimed were fired from Oswald’s rifle could not have been shot faster than 6.9 seconds, including the minimum of 2.3 seconds to set for the first shot. Secret Service Agent Roy Kellerman described the shots as a “flurry.” Two of the shots were often described by witnesses as so closely spaced that they seemed “simultaneous” and had “practically no time element between them.” Additionally, there is a substantial amount of testimony, presented in this article, that describes the later shots as sounding different from the first shot. Governor Connally’s initial reaction to the gunfire was “that there were either two or three people involved or more in this or someone was shooting with an automatic rifle.” [65]

A double sound, or bang, is described by three Secret Service agents. Two of these agents sat within feet of Kennedy as occupants of the limousine. A double shot was reported by one of the witnesses standing on the overpass.

1. Special Agent William Greer, the limousine driver, testified that “the last two shots seemed to be just simultaneously, one behind the other.” [66].

2. Secret Service Roy Kellerman sat next to Greer and was intimately familiar with the sound of weapons. Kellerman testified: ” Let me give you an illustration … You have heard the sound barrier, of a plane breaking the sound barrier, bang, bang? That is it. It was like a doublebang — bang, bang.” [67]

3. Special Agent George Hickey (in reference to the second and third shots). “At the moment he was almost sitting erect I heard two reports, which I thought were shots and that appeared to me completely different in sound than the first report and were in such rapid succession that there seemed to be practically no time element between them.” [80]

4. Special Agent Clint Hill told the Commission that the second noise he heard was different from the first shot ” … like the sound of shooting a revolver into something hard… almost a double sound.” [69]

5. S.M. Holland carefully watched the motorcade from the railroad overpass. He heard four shots with the third and fourth sounding like a “double shot.” He thought some of the shots came from behind the fence on the grassy knoll.

6. Deputy Sheriff Roger Craig: “The first shot … sort of like it reverberated … well, it was quite a pause between there [the first and second shots] … It could have been a little longer [than two or three seconds]… ” Between the second and third shots there was “no more than two seconds. It was–they were real rapid.” [71]

6. Joe R. Molina, witness “… Of course, the first shot was fired then there was an interval between the first and second, longer than the second and third.” [72]

7. DPD Seymour Weitzman. “First one, then the second two seemed to be simultaneously.” [73]

8. Ladybird Johnson. ” … suddenly there was a sharp loud report–a shot. It seemed to me to come from the right, above my shoulder, from a building. Then a moment and then two more shots in rapid succession.” [74]

9. Secret Service Special Agent Forrest V. Sorrels. “There was to me about twice as much time between the first and second shots as there was between the second and third shots.” [75]

10. Congressman Ralph W. Yarborough. “… by my estimate–to me there seemed to be a longer time between the first and second shots, a much shorter time between the second and third shots…

11. Dallas Mayor Earle Cabell. “There was a longer pause between the first and second shots than there was between the second and third shots. They were in rather rapid succession.” [77]

12. Secret Service Special Agent Sam A. Kinney. “I saw the President lean toward the left and appeared to have grabbed his chest with his right hand. There was a second of pause and then two more shots were heard … ” [78]

13. Special Agent William A. McIntyre. “The Presidential vehicle was approximately 200 feet from the underpass when the first shot was fired, followed in quick succession by two more.

14. Special Agent Warren W. Taylor. “In the instant that my left foot touched the ground, I heard two more bangs and realized that they must be gun shots.” [81]

15. Linda Willis. “Yes, I heard one. Then there was a little bit of time, and then there were two real fast bullets together. When the first one hit, well, the President turned from waving to the people, and he grabbed his throat, and he kind of slumped forward, and then I couldn’t tell where the second shot went.” [82]

16. Special Agent Rufus Youngblood. “There seemed to be a longer span of time between the first and the second shot than there was between the second and third shot.” [83] ” … from the beginning at the sound of the first shot to the second or third shot, happened with a few seconds.” [84]

17. Robert Jackson. “I would say to me it seemed like three or four seconds between the first and the second, and between the second and third, well, I guess two seconds, they were very close together … ” [85]

18. Arnold Rowland. “The actual time between the reports I would say now, after having had time to consider the six seconds between the first and second report and two between the second and third.” [86]

19. Luke Mooney. “… The second and third shot was pretty close together, but there was a short lapse there between the first and second shot.” [87]

20. Ms. Mitchell (Mary Ann Mitchell). “… there were three—the second and third being closer together than the first and second … ” [88]

21. Lee Bowers “I heard three shots. One, then a slight pause, then two very close together … also reverberation from the shots.” [89]

22. Jean Hill. “There were three shots — one right after the other, and a distinct pause, or just a moment’s pause, and I heard more … ” And concerning the shots that followed the first three Ms. Hill said they were “quicker — more automatic.” [90]

 
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